|
Post by nautical999 on Oct 13, 2009 10:00:01 GMT -5
you and i both know that it is written that all will bow down to Him in the end. even Lucifer himself.
|
|
|
Post by Bluefinger on Oct 13, 2009 10:01:23 GMT -5
ranger joe i will not get into a theological debate with someone who is inherently trying to prove God does not exist. the thing with evolution and big bang and all that people have spent billions and trillions to prove there point that God does not exist i have no need to prove he does. i have the faith it takes to believe. i have seen the supernatural stuff and have witnessed the healings emotionally of many. Christian know that it is on faith we don't need anything else Umm, Science doesn't go about trying to disprove God, it just goes and figures things out. Of course, I guess because the answers don't include God somehow means that it is all a conspiracy by Scientists to disprove his supposed existence by showing how everything actually works and not defaulting to the answer "Goddidit" or "dæmons". But here's a kicker for ya. If you are referring to the Supernatural, isn't it something that cannot be explained or is beyond that of the Natural, right? However, for you to be able to 'experience' the Supernatural, it must manifest in some form in the Natural world (we exist within the universe, and thus can only experience what is within the universe). In order to manifest, it must be bound by Natural means or at least interact with reality. However, if it manifests, it imposes a measurable effect, because it inevitably has to have a natural effect in order to be experienced. Ergo, if this stuff is real, it should have a measurable effect on the natural universe in a way that can be measured regardless by who does it. If it is real, then why must one have faith? One could simply demonstrate it without the need for faith. So why must the Supernatural be taken as faith if it is real?
|
|
|
Post by Ranger Joe on Oct 13, 2009 10:02:50 GMT -5
Ranger Joe sometimes there are things in our lives that block God from being able to get that close to us and also the other way around there is somethings that block us from getting close to Him. If you give me some history of what happened in that time period then i can direct you to where the wall was. My guess would be the false imagery of God you grew up with. i could be wrong but try me. give me some details. I will not be on here for too much longer i need to go do a job in a few but email me .............captainsplumbing@yahoo.com ............... It won't do you any harm just at the least you wasted some time. looks like you have some to spare or you wouldn't be on the net anyways. I'm actually at work preparing case defenses for foreclosure litigation. This is my stress management tool. Maybe you didn't read correctly...I was raised Pentacostal, same as you. False imagery, eh? In regards to the blocking bit, there is no other way around per your statement. You claim there are things in our lives that prevent god from getting close to us and then turn around and essentially regurgitate the same statement but just saying that there are things that prevent -us- from getting to god. For allegedly being such a loving bloke, he sure is a slippery bastard isn't he? We can have our discussions here. I don't want my friends here to miss out on anything.
|
|
|
Post by Ranger Joe on Oct 13, 2009 10:03:14 GMT -5
you and i both know that it is written that all will bow down to Him in the end. even Lucifer himself. They all have to exist in the first place for any bowing to occur.
|
|
|
Post by nautical999 on Oct 13, 2009 10:06:18 GMT -5
blue you bring up good points here
the supernatural is able to be proved with electrical devices as seen on tv with shows such as ghost hunters and the like. Howeverit is also proved by many who suffer from being tormented by the same demons who haunt. they also torment the mind and many can inherently see this. theses people do not need proof that the supernatural exists other than to admit that what they see is beyond just halucinations. Many people see the same exact thing so therefore it is not an halucination but an experience of the supernatural.
|
|
|
Post by nautical999 on Oct 13, 2009 10:09:24 GMT -5
ranger Joe in some cases demons will put up a wall that needs to be broken down it is from generational sin willful sin or sin against the person. When it is the latter of the two the unforgiveness often times will place a barrier that we can not penetrate. without spiritual help,. that is why God has placed in the body of Christ those who intercede for others on the behalf in prayer.
|
|
|
Post by Bezron on Oct 13, 2009 10:18:28 GMT -5
He is not out to exact punishment the way you were raised to believe. Really? did you really just post that? Are you a Poe that's been yanking our chains this entire time? Here is a question posed directly to you, nautical: What is the result of dying and not having submitted to your god?I was also (partly) raised pentecostal, so I do know the answer, but let's see if you do as well.
|
|
|
Post by Bluefinger on Oct 13, 2009 10:20:33 GMT -5
blue you bring up good points here the supernatural is able to be proved with electrical devices as seen on tv with shows such as ghost hunters and the like. Howeverit is also proved by many who suffer from being tormented by the same demons who haunt. they also torment the mind and many can inherently see this. theses people do not need proof that the supernatural exists other than to admit that what they see is beyond just halucinations. Many people see the same exact thing so therefore it is not an halucination but an experience of the supernatural. Umm, there's also research stating that infrasound (extremely low frequency sound) can have an effect on a person's mental condition AND also allow for the visual hallucinations due to at specific frequencies (just under 20hz) causing the eye to resonate. Here's a nice chunky paper on that (Linky). The fact that this phenomena can trigger very specific reactions from people is also worthy to look into further as a potential cause for a lot of what makes a certain place 'creepy' or 'haunted'. It is all to do with perception, and not necessarily because supernatural phenomena actually exist. Also, by what criteria are these 'ghost hunters' using electrical devices to 'detect' ghosts? Why electrical fields? Is there a reason behind that? How can we conclude that what they are detecting are not locally generated fields from other nearby electrical sources? It'll take more than just TV shows to convince me of the validity of that supposed 'evidence'.
|
|
|
Post by John E on Oct 13, 2009 10:23:28 GMT -5
Also, even the Ghost Hunters admit that environmental factors, such as strong electro-magnetic fields, can lead to creepy feelings and hallucinations that have nothing to do with the supernatural.
|
|
|
Post by Ranger Joe on Oct 13, 2009 10:27:38 GMT -5
ranger Joe in some cases demons will put up a wall that needs to be broken down it is from generational sin willful sin or sin against the person. When it is the latter of the two the unforgiveness often times will place a barrier that we can not penetrate. without spiritual help,. that is why God has placed in the body of Christ those who intercede for others on the behalf in prayer. Demons have to exist in the first place in order for them to affect people. Seriously, grow out of the fairy tale. I'm almost embarrassed for you.
|
|
|
Post by nautical999 on Oct 13, 2009 10:45:43 GMT -5
bezron
it is hell. For the most part. i believe there is a gray area in this sentence though and this area involves the people who are dissociated and have not been able to make there own decisions but have been locked away in the mind where the host does all the actions. but none will know until the day of judgement.
|
|
|
Post by Ranger Joe on Oct 13, 2009 10:47:02 GMT -5
bezron it is hell. For the most part. i believe there is a gray area in this sentence though and this area involves the people who are dissociated and have not been able to make there own decisions but have been locked away in the mind where the host does all the actions. but none will know until the day of judgement. LoL, I'm having trouble telling whether or not your actually serious. I'm banking on the troll side of things though. Or Poe.
|
|
|
Post by Bezron on Oct 13, 2009 10:47:45 GMT -5
Again, posed directly to you, Nautical:
Is or is hell not a punishment for not submitting (or accepting, or whatever term you are currently using) to your god?
Answer very carefully...
|
|
|
Post by nautical999 on Oct 13, 2009 10:52:35 GMT -5
blue
you have again made some great points however the electrical energies you refer to as causing the problems in the brain and causing halucinations and such? these are demons as well they are affecting those around and can be picked up by the use of the electrical equipment. i would bet my last dollar that if you put all schizoideffective or mentally ill people in a room by themselves you will get this energy. for that matter all who are affected by the demonic will have this as well. putting two and two together sometimes it does make 4
|
|
|
Post by nautical999 on Oct 13, 2009 10:52:51 GMT -5
blue
you have again made some great points however the electrical energies you refer to as causing the problems in the brain and causing halucinations and such? these are demons as well they are affecting those around and can be picked up by the use of the electrical equipment. i would bet my last dollar that if you put all schizoideffective or mentally ill people in a room by themselves you will get this energy. for that matter all who are affected by the demonic will have this as well. putting two and two together sometimes it does make 4
|
|