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Post by skyfire on Jul 22, 2009 8:22:44 GMT -5
You could shoot a friend/family member all-too-easily. And a bullet can travel through walls and hit someone in a different house. Here in Texas, a lot of people have taken to using shotguns loaded with bird shot or rock salt to prevent just what you've stated. Both loads are non-lethal, in the sense that they can't kill anyone. Rock salt is fairly light, and only just barely breaks the skin. The trade-off is that in those places where the skin is broken, the target now has chunks of salt. Bird shot is heavy enough to break the skin, but won't go too far in. The target will be bloody and easy to spot, but that's about it. |
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Post by Admiral Lithp on Jul 22, 2009 10:24:05 GMT -5
Redundancy is redundant.
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Post by rookie on Jul 22, 2009 10:46:45 GMT -5
Rock salt is fairly light, and only just barely breaks the skin. The trade-off is that in those places where the skin is broken, the target now has chunks of salt. Bird shot is heavy enough to break the skin, but won't go too far in. The target will be bloody and easy to spot, but that's about it. First of all, rock salt hurts like a bitch and a half. Everyone here at one point (I'm assuming) found they had a cut on their finger as they reached into a pickle jar, right? Now you have that same wonderful feeling all over where you got shot. Bird shot is non lethal? I was not aware of that. Do the pellets not travel anymore? Bird shot can be just as lethal if the victim doesn't get immediate medical attention. Another thing to think about is, while manufactures are phasing them out, lead shot is still common enough. But neither is really relevant. Guns are fucking dangerous. By their very nature they are dangerous. It's irresponsible to say otherwise. Lastly, please please for the love of ceiling cat remember who's saying this. |
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Post by wackadoodle on Jul 22, 2009 12:27:02 GMT -5
I'm buying a mingun because its such a hassle having to leave my house when I want to cut down a tree a block aaway.
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Post by Caitshidhe on Jul 22, 2009 12:31:09 GMT -5
If I recall correctly, Mythbusters did an experiment where they shot a few cigarette butts out of a shotgun, which proved lethal--point is, if you load a gun with it, it could kill you. Like Rookie said, guns are dangerous. Anybody who views gun safety in a cavalier way should be prohibited from being allowed within twenty feet of a firearm.
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Post by skyfire on Jul 22, 2009 13:58:28 GMT -5
If I recall correctly, Mythbusters did an experiment where they shot a few cigarette butts out of a shotgun, which proved lethal--point is, if you load a gun with it, it could kill you. Like Rookie said, guns are dangerous. Anybody who views gun safety in a cavalier way should be prohibited from being allowed within twenty feet of a firearm. The ballistics gel dummy had to be within a few inches of the muzzle for the cigarette butts to achieve the required penetration in order to be lethal. |
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Post by m52nickerson on Jul 22, 2009 14:12:33 GMT -5
Number one gun rule.....
Never point a gun at anything you are not willing to kill.
Rule number 2.
There are no exceptions to rule one.
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Post by captainhooker on Jul 22, 2009 14:20:06 GMT -5
Number one gun rule..... Never point a gun at anything you are not willing to kill. Rule number 2. There are no exceptions to rule one. this... it's a controlled explosion people have been killed by blanks |
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Post by Bluefinger on Jul 22, 2009 14:59:10 GMT -5
Number one gun rule..... Never point a gun at anything you are not willing to kill. Rule number 2. There are no exceptions to rule one. this... it's a controlled explosion people have been killed by blanks Yeah, I've had that drilled into me when I was in my Combined Cadet Force days. When doing exercises with blanks, we were made sure that even though we were using blanks, never to point the gun at anyone, even when they are a moderate distance away. With one exercise, we were doing an ambush, and whilst the people 'firing' on us were still a fair bit in the bushes, I still felt a blast of air against my face from a blank shot. Had there been any filings or solid bits, or had I been closer, I'd probably have a few scars on my left cheek or worse. Either way, you don't fuck with guns. |
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Post by schizophonic on Jul 22, 2009 15:19:53 GMT -5
You could shoot a friend/family member all-too-easily. And a bullet can travel through walls and hit someone in a different house. Here in Texas, a lot of people have taken to using shotguns loaded with bird shot or rock salt to prevent just what you've stated. Both loads are non-lethal, in the sense that they can't kill anyone. Rock salt is fairly light, and only just barely breaks the skin. The trade-off is that in those places where the skin is broken, the target now has chunks of salt. Bird shot is heavy enough to break the skin, but won't go too far in. The target will be bloody and easy to spot, but that's about it. I seriously have to ask: Are you retarded? Do you have some serious mental disability for which I should adjust, or are you just fucking stupid and deserved to be torn into for being that wrong about a serious, lethal weapon? Yes, but those were cigarette butts. Think about this for a second. ... Are you still missing the point? |
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Post by Caitshidhe on Jul 22, 2009 16:16:29 GMT -5
Yes, but those were cigarette butts. Think about this for a second. ... Are you still missing the point? No kidding. Way to miss the point there, Sky. The point was that something as innocuous and seemingly harmless as old cigarette butts could, under the right circumstances, be DEADLY when fired from a gun. The larger point was that whatever it is--rock salt, cigarette butts, lentils, WHATEVER--and no matter how "harmless" and "non-lethal" it SEEMS to be, if you load it into a gun and shoot it at someone, it could prove deadly. |
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Post by canadian mojo on Jul 22, 2009 20:34:42 GMT -5
Number one gun rule..... Never point a gun at anything you are not willing to kill. Rule number 2. There are no exceptions to rule one. I thought rule 2 was don't stand there talking about it and acting tough, pull the damn trigger. You know, the rule every bad guy in the movies seems to forget. Sky, I think you are not fully appreciating how close range most home defense scenarios are. You are looking at under 30'. Probably closer to 20'. (think about it, what is the longest line of sight inside your home?) At that kind of range, the pattern on a shotgun won't be larger then a foot in diameter, less if you are dealing with a full choked gun and the velocity loss would be negligible. In short, it would hit damnably hard, and is much more accurately described as a potentially lethal rather than non-lethal. Move the ranges out to about 50-60' i.e. your door to the property line, and yes, they do become far less deadly, but are you really defending yourself with a reasonable amount of force? Personally, I think part of the reason people are pro gun is simply irritation with nanny-stateism. I don't mean irritation in the sense of wanting to overthrow the government; I mean sick to death of hearing "you can't do this or have that because your too irresponsible to know what's good for you." Guns are the perfect up yours to authority, they are fun and potentally dangerous, and even more importantly, authority tends to be frightened of any that they don't control. It doesn't even have to be a juvenile up yours. It can actually be a very mature and thought out decision. A mature, responsible citizen is entitled to the rights and privileges that the country offers, and subject to the responsibilities and duties it demands. Exercising one of those rights and demanding that it be respected is simply reminding the government that it's role is not as our mother. |
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Post by lumberjackninja on Jul 22, 2009 21:14:43 GMT -5
The larger point was that whatever it is--rock salt, cigarette butts, lentils, WHATEVER--and no matter how "harmless" and "non-lethal" it SEEMS to be, if you load it into a gun and shoot it at someone, it could prove deadly. Or, putting it succinctly: Given sufficient velocity, anything will kill you. I call it Lumberjack's second theorem. |
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Post by schizophonic on Jul 22, 2009 21:41:10 GMT -5
Come to think of it, maybe it's different in Texas, but up here we've changed from "non-lethal" to "Less than lethal." You know, because tasers, rubber bullets and pepper spray all still can kill.
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Post by dasfuchs on Jul 22, 2009 21:47:58 GMT -5
Frozen french fries were a good round
When I was in the reenactment group, the general rule was 20 degree elevation and no ramming charges while in field combat...no one wants to hear the shwinginginginginginging of a ramrod flying by
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