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Post by Sandafluffoid on Mar 3, 2009 14:28:05 GMT -5
There's plenty Ukfolk on fstdt and I think we need a place to exalt our glorious leaders for all the world to see.
So I didn't actually think of anythign to say about this, so go ahead and mutter bitterly about Labour disintegrating and the conservative's ludicrously popularist economic policies or if a lib dem government would open avenues for the BNP to gain further control at the local government level.
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Post by MaybeNever on Mar 3, 2009 14:58:34 GMT -5
Okay, so, I'm not a Brit but I have a certain degree of familiarity with your governmental system. But something I've never been able to figure out is what the heck determines when you guys hold general elections. It seems really random to me. I assume MPs have to stand for re-election on a regular basis, but governments (at least in the early 20th century) seem to collapse over losing on total non-issues, like the tastiness of honey.
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Post by CtraK on Mar 3, 2009 15:03:20 GMT -5
Okay, so, I'm not a Brit but I have a certain degree of familiarity with your governmental system. But something I've never been able to figure out is what the heck determines when you guys hold general elections? It seems really random to me. I assume MPs have to stand for re-election on a regular basis, but governments (at least in the early 20th century) seem to collapse over losing on total non-issues, like the tastiness of honey. This.
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Post by Sandafluffoid on Mar 3, 2009 15:05:25 GMT -5
Okay, so, I'm not a Brit but I have a certain degree of familiarity with your governmental system. But something I've never been able to figure out is what the heck determines when you guys hold general elections? It seems really random to me. I assume MPs have to stand for re-election on a regular basis, but governments (at least in the early 20th century) seem to collapse over losing on total non-issues, like the tastiness of honey. A general election can be called by the government anytime within five years of the opening of parliament following the previous election. Elections to the Northern Irish, Welsh or Scottish Parliamentary Assembelies are held every four years. Local government elections are normally held on a fixed date, but they vary between regions. Governments in the UK rarely collapse on a single issue, more the slow growth of the opposition combined with natural british cynicism.
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Post by MaybeNever on Mar 3, 2009 15:18:42 GMT -5
Hm. Thanks guys.
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Post by szaleniec on Mar 3, 2009 17:44:56 GMT -5
Okay, so, I'm not a Brit but I have a certain degree of familiarity with your governmental system. But something I've never been able to figure out is what the heck determines when you guys hold general elections? It seems really random to me. I assume MPs have to stand for re-election on a regular basis, but governments (at least in the early 20th century) seem to collapse over losing on total non-issues, like the tastiness of honey. This.To elaborate on this, governments tend to call elections when they think they've got the best chance of winning, or hold on for the full 5 years if they know they haven't a hope in hell (cf. the Tories in the 1990s, and probably Labour now). The American system of fixed election cycles is possibly fairer.
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Post by malicious_bloke on Mar 3, 2009 17:59:54 GMT -5
Labour will be ousted at the next election, no questions asked. Even the papers that rupert murdoch doesnt own have got it in for them now.
The tories line of "we're not labour" is superficially refreshing but ultimately short on substance.
The lib dems are the "bronze medals are shiny too" party, too whiny and lacking any sort of actual basis for a campaign.
The greens are even worse with the "taxation is the way to save the planet" agenda than labour, but thankfully they dont stand in enough places to get elected.
I thought about voting UKIP (UK independance party) once, until I read deeper into them and realised how utterly catastrophic the unilateral withdrawal from the EU they seemed to be suggesting would be.
But then what does my opinion matter on any of this...I live in an area where the national racist welshmen alliance (Plaid Cymru) has got in in both elections since I moved here and probably the previous 10 before that.
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Post by szaleniec on Mar 3, 2009 18:31:45 GMT -5
Labour will be ousted at the next election, no questions asked. Even the papers that rupert murdoch doesnt own have got it in for them now. They might as well call the election tomorrow and put themselves out of their misery (but no, they're bound to hold on until 2010 now). The odds stand at 1/5 for the Tories (4/7 for an overall majority), 9/2 for Labour, 200/1 for the Lib Dems and 500/1 for any other to take the most seats. What turned me off the Lib Dems was the disconcerting tendency they developed to throw any leader who was actually popular and competent under a bus. Charles Kennedy comes to mind, as does Chris Davies from the European Parliament. I hold the same healthy scepticism towards the EU as I do for anything in politics, but to withdraw would be an epic mistake and I don't think a lot of people who support this move realise that. 30+ years in the EU have left us unsuited to stand alone, and the argument that we could still trade with the EU countries falls flat when you consider that we couldn't still trade with them on anywhere near as favourable terms as we do now. Imagine the current recession times ten (metaphorically rather than quantitatively). It would also make my split location a lot more hassle to maintain, but that's by the by.
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Post by ausador on Mar 3, 2009 19:40:47 GMT -5
I didn't know that the UK had any politics...don't you have a Queen or something? I have read some qoutes from the BNP in RSTDT, is that Englands political party or what? Oh, yeah and whats the deal with calling yourselves Britain, England, The United Kingdom, and the British Isles all at the same time? Can't you guys decide on a name? (I'm sorry guys, I just couldn't resist the impulse, in my defense I have had several beers, be kind ehh?)
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Post by szaleniec on Mar 3, 2009 19:49:57 GMT -5
I have read some qoutes from the BNP in RSTDT, is that Englands political party or what? Yep. They try wearing a veneer of respectability these days but it doesn't change the fact that just about everything they say could go on RSTDT. The British Isles are Great Britain, Ireland and their ancillary islands as a whole. The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland (to give it its full name) is the bit that isn't the Republic of Ireland, which covers most of Ireland, and is what "Britain" without qualifiers tends to refer to. It consists of four countries: England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. England is the largest and most populous of these so it's often (wrongly) used as a name for the whole shebang, which understandably annoys Scots, Welsh, Northern Irish and a lot of English.
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Post by Sandafluffoid on Mar 4, 2009 13:29:40 GMT -5
They might as well call the election tomorrow and put themselves out of their misery (but no, they're bound to hold on until 2010 now). The odds stand at 1/5 for the Tories (4/7 for an overall majority), 9/2 for Labour, 200/1 for the Lib Dems and 500/1 for any other to take the most seats. Frankly I'm glad that they 're holding on. I don't like labour but of all the current contenders brown seesm to be the only one with the experience to deal with the recession. Just a shame he's too weak to actually do it. Frankly Cameron is just too popularist for me, I wouldn't trust him with a failing economy, I'd rather have him learn the tricks of the trade as it were in a relatively stable economical situation. As for Lib Dem, I'm a lib dem supporter but their lack of a real political identity in the public mind is really holdign them back. That said, if local government elections are anything to go by, in a proportional representation election, LD would be the conservatives' opposition after 2010. I didn't know that the UK had any politics...don't you have a Queen or something I once met someone who thought the Queen was literally a dictator, it made me giggle. Effectively shes just an old woman with dreadful taste in hatwear, although apparently she is very involved backstage at westminster even though she has no real power.
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Post by malicious_bloke on Mar 4, 2009 14:43:48 GMT -5
Effectively shes just an old woman with dreadful taste in hatwear, although apparently she is very involved backstage at westminster even though she has no real power. She needs to give royal assent to any bill that passes through both houses. I don't think she has ever used her power to refuse to sign antything since she was crowned but the power is there if she needs it
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Post by Sandafluffoid on Mar 4, 2009 14:48:36 GMT -5
Effectively shes just an old woman with dreadful taste in hatwear, although apparently she is very involved backstage at westminster even though she has no real power. She needs to give royal assent to any bill that passes through both houses. I don't think she has ever used her power to refuse to sign antything since she was crowned but the power is there if she needs it Well she has the de jure abilityto dismiss the governments of Australia, Canada and the UK and appoint new leaders for the countries. But much like if she refused to sign a bill that had passed both houses the resposne would be "Shut up you silly bitch or we'll get the fuck rid of you."
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Post by disgruntledcolonel on Mar 4, 2009 16:55:25 GMT -5
Yeah, although the current model is apparently very switched on in the weekly chats with the PM, though compared to who she's chatting with that can't be too hard, I don't think the monarch's actually got seriously involved in meddling with the make up of governments or laws since Victoria.
Though with Harriet Harman and her court of public opinion - or the daily wail letters page as it is otherwise known, who needs a monarch or cabinet government?
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Post by katsuro on Mar 4, 2009 18:09:39 GMT -5
IMO there's no party in the UK worth voting for currently and I can't see that changing before the next election. The only thing to do is vote for the party you hate least, rather than vote for who you like most the way the system really should work.
What's even worse is it's been like this for the better half of a decade.
Might have to start my own party; the Super Awesome Totally Sweet Uber Party. So far the only promises on my manifesto are to introduce public floggings for anyone who says "I could care less" instead of "I couldn't care less" and forced sterilisation for anyone who says every single sentence as if it's a question (known officially as the High Rising Terminal). Not sure those will popular though.
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