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Post by xaria on May 14, 2009 8:02:33 GMT -5
using transness as an insult stick to beat someone just continues the idea that theres somehting wrong with being trans, it lets transphobia keep festering. imagine it this way, what would have happened if mr musto made a 'joke' about her being homophobic because she was adopted by black parents.
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libertyprime
Junior Member
Hey, it was acceptable in the '80s.
Posts: 58
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Post by libertyprime on May 14, 2009 8:10:59 GMT -5
using transness as an insult stick to beat someone just continues the idea that theres somehting wrong with being trans, it lets transphobia keep festering. imagine it this way, what would have happened if mr musto made a 'joke' about her being homophobic because she was adopted by black parents. wh-what? Where is the connection between homophobia and race? I don't understand... Maybe things are different across the pond (although I can't imagine why anyone, especially americans would watch countdown, and you may actually live in britain I don't know...) but I always viewed transphobia as a bit of harmless "fear what you dont understand" stupidity. You know, the whole "irrational fear that the woman you're flirting with is actually a man" sort of thing.
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Post by xaria on May 14, 2009 9:04:34 GMT -5
my point was that to make his 'humorous point' he attacked another minority that wasnt involved. (prejean isnt trans and she was not adopted by black parents)
whats the difference between being transphobic to attack someone and being racist to attack someone except its considered ok in huge sections of society to be transphobic.
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Post by Vene on May 14, 2009 13:43:34 GMT -5
Oh, yeah, transphobia is real harmless. It's no big deal, it just keeps an entire group of people stuck as second class citizens, it just leads to their family rejecting them completely, it just leads to assholes who decide to 'kill the queer.' Yep, totally fucking harmless.
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Post by devilschaplain2 on May 14, 2009 14:26:53 GMT -5
but even if there was no evidence, why couldnt you just take our word for it? how would you react to someone who thought homosexuality was a choice There are "testimonies" from gay people who claim they are straight now. Would you take that at face value? I don't. That just isn't how I do things--I always go by evidence.
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Post by devilschaplain2 on May 14, 2009 14:28:05 GMT -5
Oh, yeah, transphobia is real harmless. It's no big deal, it just keeps an entire group of people stuck as second class citizens, it just leads to their family rejecting them completely, it just leads to assholes who decide to 'kill the queer.' Yep, totally fucking harmless. Er, who said it was harmless?
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Post by Madame Scarlet on May 14, 2009 14:56:05 GMT -5
Oh, yeah, transphobia is real harmless. It's no big deal, it just keeps an entire group of people stuck as second class citizens, it just leads to their family rejecting them completely, it just leads to assholes who decide to 'kill the queer.' Yep, totally fucking harmless. Er, who said it was harmless? Libertyprime did. but I always viewed transphobia as a bit of harmless "fear what you dont understand" stupidity. You know, the whole "irrational fear that the woman you're flirting with is actually a man" sort of thing.
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Post by devilschaplain2 on May 14, 2009 15:07:33 GMT -5
Er, who said it was harmless? Libertyprime did. but I always viewed transphobia as a bit of harmless "fear what you dont understand" stupidity. You know, the whole "irrational fear that the woman you're flirting with is actually a man" sort of thing. Oooooh, okay. Must have missed that. This person should look up Robert Eads and Tyra Hunter. They were denied vital medical care because they were trannsexuals. Robert was allowed to die of cancer while Tyra died from her injuries in a car crash.
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Post by xaria on May 14, 2009 17:40:47 GMT -5
but even if there was no evidence, why couldnt you just take our word for it? how would you react to someone who thought homosexuality was a choice There are "testimonies" from gay people who claim they are straight now. Would you take that at face value? I don't. That just isn't how I do things--I always go by evidence. gays or 'ex' gays, your taking someones word for it.
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Post by devilschaplain2 on May 14, 2009 18:56:17 GMT -5
There are "testimonies" from gay people who claim they are straight now. Would you take that at face value? I don't. That just isn't how I do things--I always go by evidence. gays or 'ex' gays, your taking someones word for it. No, I don't take someone's word for it, I look at non-biased studies. So, I don't take people's opinions at face-value.
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Post by Yaezakura on May 14, 2009 19:21:49 GMT -5
But Chaplain, it's been pointed out how hard it is to find studies and such for this issue. The social stigma coupled with funding shortages and too many people having an attitude similar to yours ("It's not immediately life-threatening so isn't as important as other things") means it's an issue that gets almost no time spent on it by serious scientists. There's not a whole lot of sound medical knowledge. Most of what we have is psychological, and if you don't consider suicidal depression a serious issue, I don't think the psychological aspects will mean very much to you.
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Post by devilschaplain2 on May 14, 2009 20:08:39 GMT -5
Most of what we have is psychological, and if you don't consider suicidal depression a serious issue, I don't think the psychological aspects will mean very much to you. . Well first of all, if there is some evidence which Oriet kindly posted to support your position. I try not to believe things without evidence, not that it matters to me particularly because I don't care about whether or not people have SRS. No, I don't think suicidal depression is as serious as a physical condition which needs to be immediately corrected. I've been suicidal for years and I don't view what I have as being as serious as cancer or a serious physical birth defect which could kill me if not corrected.
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Post by Yaezakura on May 14, 2009 20:23:51 GMT -5
No, I don't think suicidal depression is as serious as a physical condition which needs to be immediately corrected. I've been suicidal for years and I don't view what I have as being as serious as cancer or a serious physical birth defect which could kill me if not corrected. But the thing, it can kill you if it goes untreated. Suicide tends to do that. And you can argue that self-control can prevent it, but not everyone has the levels of self-control needed to stop themselves. I've personally held a gun to my head in the past, and the only thing that prevented me from going through with it was someone else coming into the room. Many transsexual people feel depression of those levels, due to the sheer wrongness of their existence as the wrong sex. If HRT and SRS are the only things that can help ease those feelings, even if only in the slightest amounts, I definitely see them as valid, necessary treatments. I don't think it's more important than treatments for other conditions that may be more immediately lethal. But I feel they're as important. They're simply in important in different ways (though those ways often overlap).
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Post by xaria on May 14, 2009 20:43:27 GMT -5
gays or 'ex' gays, your taking someones word for it. No, I don't take someone's word for it, I look at non-biased studies. So, I don't take people's opinions at face-value. then do the same for trans stuff. all the scientific evidence so far points to us being born with the brain-wiring of one sex and the body of another.
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Post by devilschaplain2 on May 14, 2009 20:53:56 GMT -5
No, I don't take someone's word for it, I look at non-biased studies. So, I don't take people's opinions at face-value. then do the same for trans stuff. all the scientific evidence so far points to us being born with the brain-wiring of one sex and the body of another. And that's why I thanked Oriet for posting something of substance.
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