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Post by brendanrizzo on Nov 5, 2011 13:59:19 GMT -5
After seeing the Stockholm Syndrome-induced quotes by Elizabeth Rice Handford on the main page, which basically say that women are scum and should do ANYTHING that men say, regardless of morals, I got an idea.
I am a man. What would happen if I ordered Ms. Handford and other women who think like her to embrace the principles of feminism and women's rights? What kind of goalpost-moving do you think they'd engage in to get out of it?
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Post by Undecided on Nov 5, 2011 14:22:34 GMT -5
And you would marry them to carry out this plan? From what I can tell, her writing lauds obedience in marital contexts alone.
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Post by gyeonghwa on Nov 5, 2011 14:23:18 GMT -5
They'd say something along the lines of "It has always been this way; women needs to be subservient to men".
I'd like to point out that this is something feminists are still trying to convince people about. Both men and women perpetuate sexism because it's our society that tells them to do it. We are all obligated to fight it.
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Post by Thejebusfire on Nov 5, 2011 15:48:25 GMT -5
Did her husban know she was using the computer?
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Post by Iosa the Invincible on Nov 5, 2011 16:17:17 GMT -5
I read a comment thread for an article (forgot what I searched for, so I don't know if I can find it again) that basically went over this whole subject. It was pretty much a) it's the husband that a woman has to listen to, and b) the husband would never order her to do something contradictory to the Bible (i.e. this was the defense of women who were asked what if their husband ordered them to do something against God or ordered them to stop obeying them).
If I'm able to find the article again, I'll post it.
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Post by Meshakhad on Nov 5, 2011 16:19:49 GMT -5
This article is a wonderful counter. Using the Bible, it shows that parents do not have the right to control who their children marry, nor do women have to submit in every way to their husbands.
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Post by ironbite on Nov 5, 2011 16:58:13 GMT -5
Well obviously as a filthy jew you don't know anything about what the Babble says.
Ironbite-despite, you know, being the religion Christianity spouted from.
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Post by RavynousHunter on Nov 5, 2011 18:12:34 GMT -5
The New Testament is just Jewish fanfiction.
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Post by N. De Plume on Nov 5, 2011 18:24:17 GMT -5
I read a comment thread for an article (forgot what I searched for, so I don't know if I can find it again) that basically went over this whole subject. It was pretty much a) it's the husband that a woman has to listen to, and b) the husband would never order her to do something contradictory to the Bible (i.e. this was the defense of women who were asked what if their husband ordered them to do something against God or ordered them to stop obeying them). But if her husband would never order her to do something against God, would that not mean that following feminism, if ordered by her husband, is not against God? Same circular crap they use for most everything else.
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Post by lighthorseman on Nov 5, 2011 18:53:20 GMT -5
I read a comment thread for an article (forgot what I searched for, so I don't know if I can find it again) that basically went over this whole subject. It was pretty much a) it's the husband that a woman has to listen to, and b) the husband would never order her to do something contradictory to the Bible (i.e. this was the defense of women who were asked what if their husband ordered them to do something against God or ordered them to stop obeying them). But if her husband would never order her to do something against God, would that not mean that following feminism, if ordered by her husband, is not against God? Same circular crap they use for most everything else. Usually they get around that sort of thing by saying something like "a truly godly husband wouldn't tell hios wife to do something like that", and the subservience thing only counts if its to a "godly man". Its like the "no true Christian" thing.
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Post by brendanrizzo on Nov 5, 2011 20:31:31 GMT -5
I read a comment thread for an article (forgot what I searched for, so I don't know if I can find it again) that basically went over this whole subject. It was pretty much a) it's the husband that a woman has to listen to, and b) the husband would never order her to do something contradictory to the Bible (i.e. this was the defense of women who were asked what if their husband ordered them to do something against God or ordered them to stop obeying them). If I'm able to find the article again, I'll post it. You are probably right about the husband thing, but that quote also said something to the affect of, since no woman is sinless, their husbands could order them to do something against the Bible, and God would not stop them. No, I didn't follow the logic either. It's fundie logic; what do you expect?
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Post by N. De Plume on Nov 5, 2011 21:28:37 GMT -5
But if her husband would never order her to do something against God, would that not mean that following feminism, if ordered by her husband, is not against God? Same circular crap they use for most everything else. Usually they get around that sort of thing by saying something like "a truly godly husband wouldn't tell hios wife to do something like that", and the subservience thing only counts if its to a "godly man". Its like the "no true Christian" thing. So, in other words, it is possible for the husband to order her to do something against god, since it is possible that the husband is not “truly godly”.
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Post by Iosa the Invincible on Nov 5, 2011 22:03:32 GMT -5
Apparently a book by Elizabeth Rice Handford says that if a husband were to truly ever command something against God, the wife has to pray hard enough and then God will change his mind.
Edit: Oh, and from the gist I got from the comments on an Amazon page for one of her books, she advocates this because it lifts responsibility from women, thereby making her unaccountable to everyone including God, so it's a good thing to lose your free will and individuality. Of course, that's only if you're a perfect wife and completely subservient. If bad things like spousal abuse happen, it is the woman's fault because God feels she's not doing enough.
Again, I haven't actually read any of the books, but that's the impression I got by reading the comments on Amazon.
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Post by N. De Plume on Nov 5, 2011 22:29:59 GMT -5
Yeah, I finally looked at her quote on the main page. She actually says that if your husband is telling you to do something against God it is because you are not being subservient enough.
I have no idea how that is supposed to make any sort of sense.
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Post by lighthorseman on Nov 5, 2011 23:13:04 GMT -5
Usually they get around that sort of thing by saying something like "a truly godly husband wouldn't tell hios wife to do something like that", and the subservience thing only counts if its to a "godly man". Its like the "no true Christian" thing. So, in other words, it is possible for the husband to order her to do something against god, since it is possible that the husband is not “truly godly”. But of course, a truly godly woman wouldn't marry an ungodly man. Don't try to follow the logic.
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