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Post by Chi Shiro on Dec 22, 2009 2:47:49 GMT -5
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FrizzleFry
Full Member
Some Really Interesting Guy
Posts: 147
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Post by FrizzleFry on Dec 22, 2009 2:57:28 GMT -5
Uh... I thought IQ was a fixed "number" that as such doesn't change regardless of experience. But then again, I could be wrong... it's happened once or twice before, y'know...
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Post by Tiger on Dec 22, 2009 3:06:16 GMT -5
If I understand correctly, while IQ is by no means "fixed", it tends to stay constant after your formative years are completed.
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Post by MaybeNever on Dec 22, 2009 3:08:03 GMT -5
IQ is unfortunately a somewhat amorphous concept that is not always interpreted (or tested) the same way. Even the same test can often be interpreted in a few different ways to yield a different IQ score. Particularly in children under twelve, IQ varies enormously simply because neural plasticity (that is, the ability of the brain to rewire itself from experience) is at its highest. By 12 or so plasticity drops off significantly (though never totally) and IQ results start to stabilize when other factors are held steady.
I'm not sure I buy the conclusions these folks are selling, though. I'd have to see the methodology used in gathering and assessing these data first. The article stresses that they went to pains to eliminate confounding factors, but honestly that's for peer-review to determine. I could see how it might happen - spanking is stressful, stress causes cortisol production, cortisol kills brain cells or inhibits cortical development - but claiming a causal link is an extremely... serious step to take.
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Post by maanantai on Dec 22, 2009 3:20:40 GMT -5
So.. was the IQ of the spanking parents also tested? I know that their education, income levels and such things were noticed, but I noticed that nothing about IQ of the parents was said...
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Post by Dragon Zachski on Dec 22, 2009 3:27:39 GMT -5
The problem with this study is that while spanking is a blanket meaning for "smacking the butt", there's several factors to be considered. What was the reason for the spanking? How many times was the child spanked? Was a tool used? How long was the time span between the act of disobedience and the act of spanking? And probably most importantly, how SEVERE was the spanking? Comparing extremes...
If...
Reason: Any disobedience
Times: More than once
Tool: Yes
When: Anytime over an hour after said act of disobedience
Severity: Sitting would be agony for weeks
Then yes, it's excessive and would have a detrimental effect on a child's psychology. It doesn't take a study to see that.
But on the opposite end of the spectrum....
If...
Reason: If disobedience could have resulted in serious harm to the child or anyone around the child (TL;DR: A very serious act of disobedience)
Times: Just once
Tools: No
Time: Immediately after
Severity: Tingles for a few minutes
Then it becomes a bit more iffy. At least, that's how I think I understand the situation. I might be wrong.
I'm not for spanking. I think it's a dire-needs form of discipline that requires an explanation in addition to said punishment. I hate how people abuse it.
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Post by tiado on Dec 22, 2009 3:42:38 GMT -5
If I wasn't spanked, I might have been smarter than I am?
Then again, I think I was only spanked like 6-7 times in my entire life.
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Post by wmdkitty on Dec 22, 2009 4:01:19 GMT -5
I was only spanked once. Not a clue what I did, but I must have earned it....
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Post by Mira on Dec 22, 2009 4:01:24 GMT -5
I haven't read anything because I'm lazy, but it seems like they're implying causation from correlation. It could just be that higher IQ parents tend not to spank or some other factor that isn't being considered.
With that being said I've never once been physically disciplined (and not many more occasions of any discipline at all...) My IQ is fairly above average, but I don't really see any kind of link between the two.
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Post by secretsquirrelsock on Dec 22, 2009 5:16:06 GMT -5
Ah... but do they have low IQs because they are spanked, or are they spanked because they have low IQs?
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Post by wmdkitty on Dec 22, 2009 7:31:32 GMT -5
Ah... but do they have low IQs because they are spanked, or are they spanked because they have low IQs? Now THAT is a good question! |
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Post by MaybeNever on Dec 22, 2009 8:01:58 GMT -5
Not if you've read the article, where it is specifically stated that the researchers ruled that out. Whether or not that's accurate I have no idea, but longitudinal studies do tend to control or at least account for some variables that shorter studies don't or can't.
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Post by wmdkitty on Dec 22, 2009 8:06:00 GMT -5
Dunno, man. K, I'm kinda drunk, but in my experience, kids wif lower IQs tend to attract/elicit more physical punishments. Ish der a correlations? Aifinkso!
Imma crash now, kinda drunk.
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Post by Sleepy on Dec 22, 2009 10:33:52 GMT -5
I haven't read anything because I'm lazy, but it seems like they're implying causation from correlation. It could just be that higher IQ parents tend not to spank or some other factor that isn't being considered. This is what I was thinking. Parents with lower IQs probably use spanking more frequently as a punishment than those who have higher IQs. The kids are raised by different parents in different conditions. Thus, their IQs vary accordingly. |
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Post by spaniel on Dec 22, 2009 12:54:01 GMT -5
I find it funny that I came across this thread whilst listening to that Russel Peters sketch about people who beat their kids.
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