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Post by Dragon Zachski on Apr 2, 2010 1:48:51 GMT -5
Bullshit.
I was explaining to my Worse-Than-Republican-Dad about how people with life-threatening illnesses in Canada and Britain are bumped to the front of the line.
His response? "Bullshit. They'd rather see me die."
He truly believes that they follow the philosophy of "If you aren't giving anything to society, you don't deserve to live"
What complete and utter bullshit. I'm so pissed right now.
He refuses to believe ANYTHING good about health care. Bring up an anecdote and he'll doubt you. But the moment Glenn Beck breathes so much as a negative word about Canada or Britain's health care system and he's all over it.
So tell me: Is this the "Death panel" bullshit that the Tea Party's been vomiting? Or is this a separate but equally deceitful issue? Because I'm not really sure anymore.
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Post by mistermuncher on Apr 2, 2010 1:57:52 GMT -5
It's certainly similar. I can only presume these misconceptions take root so deeply because the word "triage" still sounds a bit too French for some people's liking.
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Post by ltfred on Apr 2, 2010 2:14:59 GMT -5
If he's on medicare, medicaid or the VA, pont out that his health insurance is run accorsing to exactly the same philosophy.
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Post by id82 on Apr 2, 2010 2:17:50 GMT -5
So I wonder how long it will be before people like this realize that it's not a bad thing? 10 years? 20 years?
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Post by dasfuchs on Apr 2, 2010 6:32:49 GMT -5
Eh, it'll be like abortion...it's biggest opponents will bitch and scream it's evil, but use it anyways...oh wait, how silly of me, lots of the people that screamd the loudest already use a socialized style system that they're garunteed till the day they day because they were elected
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Post by canadian mojo on Apr 2, 2010 7:30:39 GMT -5
Bullshit. I was explaining to my Worse-Than-Republican-Dad about how people with life-threatening illnesses in Canada and Britain are bumped to the front of the line. His response? "Bullshit. They'd rather see me die." He truly believes that they follow the philosophy of "If you aren't giving anything to society, you don't deserve to live" What complete and utter bullshit. I'm so pissed right now. He refuses to believe ANYTHING good about health care. Bring up an anecdote and he'll doubt you. But the moment Glenn Beck breathes so much as a negative word about Canada or Britain's health care system and he's all over it. So tell me: Is this the "Death panel" bullshit that the Tea Party's been vomiting? Or is this a separate but equally deceitful issue? Because I'm not really sure anymore. He's right. You need to invade Canada right now and save us from our evil overlords. Frankly, I find the level of projection and willful blindness coming from the right rather amazing. If you don't have insurance (i.e. don't have a job and 'aren't contributing to society') you get to fuck-of and die. If an insurance company panel decides not to cover a procedure because it costs a lot, you get to fuck-off and die. If private industry does it, it's okay, if government does it, it's the embodiment of evil. |
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Post by Vene on Apr 2, 2010 9:49:36 GMT -5
Triage, people, it's already done. Not to mention that only really applies to the ER, when you make appointments, well, that's when you're going to be there. And to refuse to wait an extra week for a routine thing so other people can have an essential service, well, that's the height of selfishness.
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Post by Old Viking on Apr 2, 2010 14:52:29 GMT -5
I thought triage has something to do with sex.
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Post by kristine on Apr 2, 2010 15:12:33 GMT -5
If private industry does it, it's okay, if government does it, it's the embodiment of evil. I've talked to several people who are under the impression that no one in the government (any government) can ever do anything right (they call themselves 'independants' because they hated Bush too) so the one ones they only marginally trust are the private companies. When I bring up how many times private industry has screwed a lot of people they respond by saying 'the market will take care of them eventually - people will see they are being screwed and stop using those businesses.' Yeah, that works...  |
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Post by booley on Apr 2, 2010 17:13:51 GMT -5
Bullshit. I was explaining to my Worse-Than-Republican-Dad about how people with life-threatening illnesses in Canada and Britain are bumped to the front of the line. His response? "Bullshit. They'd rather see me die." He truly believes that they follow the philosophy of "If you aren't giving anything to society, you don't deserve to live" What complete and utter bullshit. I'm so pissed right now. He refuses to believe ANYTHING good about health care. Bring up an anecdote and he'll doubt you. But the moment Glenn Beck breathes so much as a negative word about Canada or Britain's health care system and he's all over it. So tell me: Is this the "Death panel" bullshit that the Tea Party's been vomiting? Or is this a separate but equally deceitful issue? Because I'm not really sure anymore. Makes one wonder. IF Britain and Canada kill their elderly and the US doesn't, then why do people in Canada and Britain have longer life spans on average? I mean in Canada mandatory retirement is 65 with the average being 62. But the average life span is over 80. In the US the average life expectancy is 78. That's a pretty big gap when Canadians wouldn't be contributing back to society. How would your Dad explain that? Though I doubt he would answer that honestly. I am afraid there is little to be done about him. He refuses to see so he won't. Facts only get accepted if they fit and in his world, what you are saying doesn't fit regardless whether what you say is true or not. |
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Post by Dragon Zachski on Apr 2, 2010 17:42:53 GMT -5
I am afraid there is little to be done about him. He refuses to see so he won't. Facts only get accepted if they fit and in his world, what you are saying doesn't fit regardless whether what you say is true or not. This is pretty spot-on. However, he really pissed me off because at the beginning, I brought up the man with Parkinson's who was mocked by the Tea baggers, and he called it an "isolated incident" and chastised me for looking down on the tea baggers. >_> Yeah, sure Dad, insulting me like that is sure to help me see your point of view. And he claims to be open-minded and he "enjoys" that I hold different opinions from him, but his interpretation of open-minded is "You're open-minded if you agree with my philosophy". I could tell because his voice was gradually getting louder throughout the "debate" and he had a tinge of panic in his voice. Oh yeah, and he absolutely does not want me telling ANYONE that I'm gay. I think he tries to forget that I'm gay. EDIT: I forgot to mention that he also believes that I was "recruited" into homosexuality. I can't imagine the aneurysm he would have if he found out I'm dating. ...Oh yeah, that's another thing. It's been YEARS since he's seen a doctor, and he just now claimed that he's waiting for me to move out before he visits a doctor. So, great, put the responsibility and weight on me, why dontcha? |
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Post by Damen on Apr 3, 2010 4:08:48 GMT -5
Ask him why.
When he answers; laugh at him. And point. Don't forget to point at him while laughing. A belly laugh.
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Post by mrsyoungie on Apr 3, 2010 12:37:01 GMT -5
If some of these nay sayers actually came up to Canada and saw for themselves what our (imperfect, but still better than nothing) healthcare system is like, would they believe their own eyes?
If they could go to a hospital and watch elderly people being cared for, premie babies being cared for, people with pre-existing conditions getting surgeries etc. that they need with no insurance company to get in the way or look into their application with a microscope looking for loopholes.
Would they believe then?
And, yes, I have a government issued health card. But I also have a government issued drivers licence and Social Insurance number. Big deal. I had cancer 5 years ago and I'm still here. That's more important to me and my family.
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Post by kzickas on Apr 3, 2010 12:55:42 GMT -5
given nietzsche´s focus on personal morality I´m not sure a government can really follow a nietzschean philosofy
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Post by ltfred on Apr 3, 2010 19:51:27 GMT -5
given nietzsche´s focus on personal morality I´m not sure a government can really follow a nietzschean philosofy Unless the president is the superman who doesn't have to consider other people as people. That would actually work better than anything else, actually. |
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