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Post by JonathanE on May 7, 2009 19:05:15 GMT -5
It is the arrogance of the act that srikes me most. This reaffirmation that all other methods of worshipping Jesus are wrong, and only by baptizing every "soul" that has ever lived will the world have a chance at redemption. After all, all other sects are an abomination, according the word god gave the young 14 year prophet Joseph.
Amazing arrogance.
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Post by antichrist on May 7, 2009 19:13:35 GMT -5
WTF! I feel the urge to slap someone. ETA: "It matters" in the sense of imposing yourself on a corpse against the wishes of the family. Beyond rude. Post-death baptism--like necrophilia, in a way. Except the family isn't invited. I'm sure my sister has had all of my grandparents and mother done, in fact I'm sure most families don't know that it has been done. Edit: Oh, I agree that it's absolute arrogance. It's insane, I mean why bother being moral on this earth since it will be taken care of after you're dead.
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Post by mistermuncher on May 7, 2009 19:22:27 GMT -5
Objectively, it makes fuck all difference.
Now, find me someone who views their dead relatives' wishes in an entirely objective light. Reward shall comprise the traditional piano, one of my legs, and my wife.
Anything that upsets the bereaved for no rational purpose, through malice or ignorance, is an action of jaw-cracking arseholery. I don't think "Vicarious Baptism" is ethically or logically any different to pissing on the graves of the deceased. Show some fucking respect, you arrogant, tactless shitehawks.
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Post by Death on May 7, 2009 22:31:44 GMT -5
The practice pisses me off big time.
A friend comes from a prominant family of atheists. I am sure they would be horrified if they learnt that the lds has proxy baptised their grand and great grand parents.
The really bad thing here is that their names are now on a list of religious adherents. And could even be used by the lds for publicity, even though they stand for everything they fought against. Like freedom from belief.
Side note. Wonder what muslims would think if they discovered that Mohammed and his family have all been baptised. It's in the records.
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Post by ironbite on May 8, 2009 0:51:38 GMT -5
Now, find me someone who views their dead relatives' wishes in an entirely objective light. Reward shall comprise the traditional piano, one of my legs, and my wife. I'd need pictures of the piano, your legs and Mrs. Muncher.
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starbrewer
Full Member
God can go to hell
Posts: 226
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Post by starbrewer on May 8, 2009 6:46:35 GMT -5
Adolf Hitler, Genghis Khan, Josef Stalin, Joan of Arc, The Buddha, Anne Frank, what other dead people has the LDS baptized?
Just for that, I want to go an unbaptism hosted by American Atheists. They said that they will unbaptize you even if you have never been baptized to begin with!
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Post by schizophonic on May 8, 2009 9:32:39 GMT -5
It's about respect for the dead and respect for other religious practices.
That being said, I wonder. If you get baptised after you've been dead for a hundred years, do you get pulled out of wherever you were and sent to Mormon Heaven? Like, if I'm chilling with Bacchus, am I yanked away and sent to chill with Joseph Smith and Brigham Young?
...Followup: Wouldn't that REALLY be Hell?
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Post by dantesvirgil on May 8, 2009 9:45:15 GMT -5
Well, but couldn't you make up your own mind and then say, "Nah, I'd rather get back to Bacchus?"
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Post by schizophonic on May 8, 2009 10:14:17 GMT -5
I dunno. If it was that simple, wouldn't baptism be a was...OHHHHHH!
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Post by deliciousdemon on May 8, 2009 11:04:25 GMT -5
I think we should start pissing on Mormon graves......or burn pentagrams on them. Since they feel they can do that shit, I can baptize their people in my own ways right? Sorry mate, you need to be "christian" and rich to be above common courtesy. Try again next year!
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Post by trendkill on May 8, 2009 21:27:09 GMT -5
It's about respect for the dead and respect for other religious practices. That being said, I wonder. If you get baptised after you've been dead for a hundred years, do you get pulled out of wherever you were and sent to Mormon Heaven? Like, if I'm chilling with Bacchus, am I yanked away and sent to chill with Joseph Smith and Brigham Young? ...Followup: Wouldn't that REALLY be Hell? They actually believe that once you die, you go to the Spirit World, which is divided into two sections: Spirit Paradise, which is set aside for people who accepted the Gospel and were baptized, went to church, got married in the Temple, etc., while they were alive Spirit Prison, which is for everyone else. While a spirit is in Paradise, one of the things that they do while they pass the time until Judgment/Resurrection is missionary work to the souls that are in Prison. If a spirit who is in Prison chooses to do so, they can accept the gospel postmortem. The catch is that for them to be accepted into the Celestial, Telestial, or Terrestrial Kingdoms (listed in order of glory from highest to lowest, these are the different "versions" of heaven), even though they have accepted the "truth", they need to be baptized by immersion in water. A spirit, however, doesn't have a body to do this. The great compromise for this is to have the living stand in for the deceased for the ritual. I really wish I was making this up. . . But I've actually participated in it. . . Edit: Fixed my punctuation fail.
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Post by rookie on May 8, 2009 22:57:57 GMT -5
So the spirit comes down and posses a body? I think I understand.
Like I could be walking along when Teddy Roosevelt's spirit comes into me and directs me to the nearest temple. He says while hanging out with Janis Joplin he found Joe Smith. So now he needs to be posthumously baptized. But he needs my body because his has been busy pushing daises for far to long to be any good to go swimming in. And with a wave of his magic wand and a presto-chango! a LDS priest or equivalent baptizes good ol' TR and me at the same time, only mine didn't count because me as Rookie never wanted anything more than to get that pack of smokes I left the house in the first place for on that fateful day.
Am I close?
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Post by trendkill on May 8, 2009 23:00:26 GMT -5
Not exactly. . . The living person just performs the ritual on the deceased's behalf, and it's recognized in Heavenly Father's (since they call him that instead of God) eyes.
Oh wait. . . Sarcasm. . . I get it!
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Post by rookie on May 8, 2009 23:02:50 GMT -5
Not exactly. . . The living person just performs the ritual on the deceased's behalf, and it's recognized in Heavenly Father's (since they call him that instead of God) eyes. Oh wait. . . Sarcasm. . . I get it! Got it. So in my scenario, I go to Mormon Joe and say "TR would have wanted it this way. So I'll fill in for him."
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Post by trendkill on May 8, 2009 23:06:02 GMT -5
Kind of. The names are pulled by people working in the Family History Center, who try and find out who's related to who and who wasn't baptized before they died.
Or, if you have a deceased ancestor that wasn't baptized, provided you've done your genealogy work correctly, you can specifically request to be baptized for them.
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