chagen
Junior Member
Not Banned
Posts: 71
|
Post by chagen on May 5, 2011 17:06:57 GMT -5
Yes. I believe in the idea of the Virtuous Pagan, though. So I don't think people will go to hell just for having a different culture/religion. What if their culture/religion tells them things opposed to in the Bible are virtuous? Most of the time, the Bible's moral code is relatively normal--Don't kill, don't steal, don't commit adultery...any religion which had to oppose that would probably be some kind of death cult or something similar. Find a respected atheist who defends genocide and infanticide. I can find a respected theologian who does. See for yourself.This man is a crazy fundie, that's for sure. In any case, if he's well-respected, that's the problem of the religion's followers, as texts can have many different interpretations. Christianity has reached a low here in America. |
|
|
|
Post by Vene on May 5, 2011 17:11:33 GMT -5
What if their culture/religion tells them things opposed to in the Bible are virtuous? Most of the time, the Bible's moral code is relatively normal--Don't kill, don't steal, don't commit adultery...any religion which had to oppose that would probably be some kind of death cult or something similar. Perfectly normal. From Leviticus 11 1 The LORD said to Moses, 2 “Say to the Israelites: ‘A woman who becomes pregnant and gives birth to a son will be ceremonially unclean for seven days, just as she is unclean during her monthly period. 3 On the eighth day the boy is to be circumcised. 4 Then the woman must wait thirty-three days to be purified from her bleeding. She must not touch anything sacred or go to the sanctuary until the days of her purification are over. 5 If she gives birth to a daughter, for two weeks the woman will be unclean, as during her period. Then she must wait sixty-six days to be purified from her bleeding.
6 “‘When the days of her purification for a son or daughter are over, she is to bring to the priest at the entrance to the tent of meeting a year-old lamb for a burnt offering and a young pigeon or a dove for a sin offering. 7 He shall offer them before the LORD to make atonement for her, and then she will be ceremonially clean from her flow of blood.
“‘These are the regulations for the woman who gives birth to a boy or a girl. 8 But if she cannot afford a lamb, she is to bring two doves or two young pigeons, one for a burnt offering and the other for a sin offering. In this way the priest will make atonement for her, and she will be clean.’” Do you realize his reasoning is Biblically sound? |
|
|
|
Post by anti-nonsense on May 5, 2011 17:11:34 GMT -5
well what about the whole "gay sex is bad' thing, the Ancient Greeks had practically institutionalized gay sex going on, or at least some of them did. Would they go to hell for having gay sex even though their culture taught them it was a good thing to do?
|
|
|
|
Post by devilschaplain2 on May 5, 2011 17:18:53 GMT -5
Notice how nearly every single one of the comments are subtly agreeing with him. Hell, some of them are explicitly agreeing with him. And you guys wonder why anti-theism gives me a sour taste. Really? Because I'm reading through the comments and that's not what I see. In fact, a majority of them look like this: And so on. |
|
chagen
Junior Member
Not Banned
Posts: 71
|
Post by chagen on May 5, 2011 17:34:59 GMT -5
Perfectly normal. From Leviticus 11 1 The LORD said to Moses, 2 “Say to the Israelites: ‘A woman who becomes pregnant and gives birth to a son will be ceremonially unclean for seven days, just as she is unclean during her monthly period. 3 On the eighth day the boy is to be circumcised. 4 Then the woman must wait thirty-three days to be purified from her bleeding. She must not touch anything sacred or go to the sanctuary until the days of her purification are over. 5 If she gives birth to a daughter, for two weeks the woman will be unclean, as during her period. Then she must wait sixty-six days to be purified from her bleeding.
6 “‘When the days of her purification for a son or daughter are over, she is to bring to the priest at the entrance to the tent of meeting a year-old lamb for a burnt offering and a young pigeon or a dove for a sin offering. 7 He shall offer them before the LORD to make atonement for her, and then she will be ceremonially clean from her flow of blood.
“‘These are the regulations for the woman who gives birth to a boy or a girl. 8 But if she cannot afford a lamb, she is to bring two doves or two young pigeons, one for a burnt offering and the other for a sin offering. In this way the priest will make atonement for her, and she will be clean.’” Those are views of the people of the day. The Bible was written way back thousands of years ago--things where much, much different back then. Those things you posted do not matter anymore in today's society. Only if you twist the words and intepret them literally. The Bible is a very vauge book. well what about the whole "gay sex is bad' thing, the Ancient Greeks had practically institutionalized gay sex going on, or at least some of them did. Would they go to hell for having gay sex even though their culture taught them it was a good thing to do? First of all, I think that the whole "gay sex is bad" thing is cultural baggage--the Bible was written by a bunch of falliable humans--there's nothing saying that they didn't put some of the day's values in the book. After all, It would be taken as the word of God, and no one would dare challenge It. God loves all equally. He loves the Atheist as much as He loves the Theist, and He loves the Straight man as much as He loves the Gay man. As for the Greek's, it would depend on the other things they did. But as for culture, there is no "Christian" culture. All cultures are equal in God's eyes. |
|
|
|
Post by Vene on May 5, 2011 17:37:50 GMT -5
"The Lord said to Moses" equals "views of the people of the day" how?
|
|
|
|
Post by Admiral Lithp on May 5, 2011 17:45:04 GMT -5
He's not going to read it anyway and fuck you too Lithp. Fuck me? Fuck you! |
|
|
|
Post by DeadpanDoubter on May 5, 2011 18:12:15 GMT -5
Chagen, the Bible can be interpreted probably thousands of different ways-- off the top of my head, I can think of several ways to interpret different passages.
I daresay, though, that "most" of the Bible's teachings are NOT good for society; for example, take the "Thou Shalt Not Kill" commandment. That's all well and good...until God turned around and told the Israelites, REPEATEDLY, to destroy their and His enemies:
If you want to argue that those weren't God's words through a prophet's mouth, very well. But you need to tell us how we can KNOW when passages ARE straight from God, and when they're not. We need a set of criteria to work from.
|
|
|
|
Post by Art Vandelay on May 5, 2011 18:18:33 GMT -5
Furthermore, if you believe that the bible is merely a product of its time as opposed to the infallible word of God, then why the fuck would you practise a religion that's built around it?!
|
|
|
|
Post by DeadpanDoubter on May 5, 2011 18:23:39 GMT -5
Well...there's that, too, but shh, Vene might have some fun.
|
|
|
|
Post by Mlle Antéchrist on May 5, 2011 18:28:57 GMT -5
Notice how nearly every single one of the comments are subtly agreeing with him. Hell, some of them are explicitly agreeing with him. And you guys wonder why anti-theism gives me a sour taste. Did you read my post earlier on the page? There is a huge, HUGE difference between agreeing that the world would be better without religion, and agreeing with what he said. |
|
chagen
Junior Member
Not Banned
Posts: 71
|
Post by chagen on May 5, 2011 18:53:06 GMT -5
Furthermore, if you believe that the bible is merely a product of its time as opposed to the infallible word of God, then why the fuck would you practise a religion that's built around it?! Because: A) It still is good in some ways. B) I have been raised so long in a Christian environment that I pretty much am physically incapable of of the idea of living as an Atheist. I could become an Atheist tomorrow, and basically nothing in my life would change. I barely practice the religion at all, I haven't been to church in like....damn, around 4 years? |
|
|
|
Post by Admiral Lithp on May 5, 2011 18:58:32 GMT -5
Then do it?
|
|
|
|
Post by devilschaplain2 on May 5, 2011 19:00:49 GMT -5
Furthermore, if you believe that the bible is merely a product of its time as opposed to the infallible word of God, then why the fuck would you practise a religion that's built around it?! Because: A) It still is good in some ways. B) I have been raised so long in a Christian environment that I pretty much am physically incapable of of the idea of living as an Atheist. I could become an Atheist tomorrow, and basically nothing in my life would change. I barely practice the religion at all, I haven't been to church in like....damn, around 4 years? I should add that leaving Christianity doesn't necessarily mean one is or ought to be an atheist. There are a ton of belief systems out there. |
|
chagen
Junior Member
Not Banned
Posts: 71
|
Post by chagen on May 5, 2011 19:16:46 GMT -5
Because: A) It still is good in some ways. B) I have been raised so long in a Christian environment that I pretty much am physically incapable of of the idea of living as an Atheist. I could become an Atheist tomorrow, and basically nothing in my life would change. I barely practice the religion at all, I haven't been to church in like....damn, around 4 years? I should add that leaving Christianity doesn't necessarily mean one is or ought to be an atheist. There are a ton of belief systems out there. I know that. But I feel like I should either be a christian or an Atheist. I'm not too keen on switching belief systems. I'll probably just stay an Agnostic. |
|
