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Post by Dragon Zachski on Sept 5, 2011 16:48:50 GMT -5
Honestly, if Kerry hadn't been the democratic presidential candidate then, you democrats might've had a fighting chance.
I say "you democrats" because I was a young republican at the time :[
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Post by nickiknack on Sept 5, 2011 17:09:46 GMT -5
Sounds very much like what I've been saying for years, along with others such as Bill Maher.
1. we do have very fractioned Democratic Party, and the fact that the DLCers/3rd wayers seem to have a lot of the control doesn't help. The Democrats need to be a center-left party instead of a center-right one. No more spineless corporate whores allowed.
2. The Democrats SUCK when it comes to getting the message out, and it doesn't help that the right seems to have more money to spend when it comes to getting the message out.
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Post by styphon on Sept 5, 2011 18:23:37 GMT -5
It also doesn't help when the Democrat President buckles like a belt.
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Post by Amaranth on Sept 5, 2011 19:21:06 GMT -5
It also doesn't help when the Democrat President buckles like a belt. Or fold like a house of cards. |
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Post by itachirumon on Sept 5, 2011 19:53:47 GMT -5
Sounds very much like what I've been saying for years, along with others such as Bill Maher. 1. we do have very fractioned Democratic Party, and the fact that the DLCers/3rd wayers seem to have a lot of the control doesn't help. The Democrats need to be a center-left party instead of a center-right one. No more spineless corporate whores allowed. 2. The Democrats SUCK when it comes to getting the message out, and it doesn't help that the right seems to have more money to spend when it comes to getting the message out. >>The right has a limitless money-machine by tapping religious nutters like the Mormons - remember Prop 8 and the "forced tithing" that whole "Your family makes X per year? You can donate Y to the campaign, do so now or you're excommunicated" |
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Post by nickiknack on Sept 5, 2011 19:55:57 GMT -5
that's an insult to cards and buckles everywhere...
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Post by Amaranth on Sept 5, 2011 20:00:25 GMT -5
that's an insult to cards and buckles everywhere... You have a point. I retract my comment and hang my head in shame. An outside force is usually needed to make a house of cards fold. |
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Post by nickiknack on Sept 5, 2011 20:00:54 GMT -5
That's precisely the problem. It seems like the democrats CAN'T do anything unless they become the very thing that they stand against. The thing is that the Democratic Party has already became Republican-lite, policy wise at least...what they need is soul searching, and to re-discover themselves and their beliefs... |
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Post by Amaranth on Sept 5, 2011 20:10:21 GMT -5
Do you really think they have any souls remaining?
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Post by nickiknack on Sept 5, 2011 20:19:29 GMT -5
You got a point there...I forgot that they sold them to the corporations...
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Post by Amaranth on Sept 5, 2011 20:32:33 GMT -5
You got a point there...I forgot that they sold them to the corporations... Leaving us twisting in the cold. |
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Post by Vene on Sept 5, 2011 20:46:09 GMT -5
That's precisely the problem. It seems like the democrats CAN'T do anything unless they become the very thing that they stand against. The thing is that the Democratic Party has already became Republican-lite, policy wise at least...what they need is soul searching, and to re-discover themselves and their beliefs... The blue dogs need to leave the party, forcibly if necessary. That would get rid of a lot of the right wing tendencies. Edit: Something we can do on the personal level is pay more attention to primaries other than for the presidency and support candidates who are actually liberal. People are less likely to vote in a primary for a state senator than for their governor and, as a result, a single vote means a lot more. |
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Post by N. De Plume on Sept 5, 2011 21:10:25 GMT -5
I'm not saying the left can take control, but they seem to bring part of the beating on themselves. Like when "Hope" and "Change" turned into "Compromise" and "Submission." Hell, Compromise is what politics is supposed to be about. The problem is that they fail at Compromise. They think that Compromise works by letting the more stubborn party get pretty much everything they ask for. That’s not compromise. That’s rolling over and dieing. |
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Post by Amaranth on Sept 5, 2011 21:18:35 GMT -5
Compromise isn't always what it's about. They had a clear mandate from the people going in, and the "Supermajority" to push it through. They stalled long enough, and caved fast enough to let public opinion slide.
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Post by verasthebrujah on Sept 5, 2011 21:25:36 GMT -5
The problem is that the Democrats could never win a majority without the Blue Dogs. Most of New England, parts of California, Oregon, and Washington, and cities will elect progressives, but the South, Midwest, and West won't. Even in "blue" districts, progressives have a much harder time winning a general election than a moderate or a Blue Dog.
Political history is a pendulum, and it usually takes a major screw up from one party to push the pendulum back. Think about it-- the only Democrats elected president between the Civil War and the Great Depression were Cleveland and Wilson (and they only won because of divisions in the Republican Party). Between the Great Depression and Vietnam, the only Republican elected was the war hero Eisenhower (and many hoped that he would run as a Democrat). Now in the Reagan Era, the Republicans are in control. Even the Democrats are a conservative party now. This probably won't change until the Republicans push everything so far to the right that there are major socioeconomic consequences.
...er... major socioeconomic consequences that they can't blame on the black guy.
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