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Post by tolpuddlemartyr on Oct 31, 2011 20:58:02 GMT -5
She realized that even though she was highly outspoken against violence against women, she'd never actually been a victim of it herself. Therefore, she began to take every slightest thing the guy did as an indication that he intended to rape or beat her, and that his pleas for her to just consider his feelings constituted emotional abuse. ...and then there are the loonies who think abuse/victimization/a bad childhood/PTSD is a "badge of honor" and feel "uncool" because it didn't happen to them. A whole new brand of stupid!  |
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Post by Admiral Lithp on Oct 31, 2011 21:04:08 GMT -5
I can. I'm sure there are a lot on those pages. One that occurred to me earlier was Bleach. While I normally think it's pretty good regarding gender issues, I notice that none of its slapstick ever extends to a woman.
In fact, I think that might be true of slapstick in general.
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Post by Dragon Zachski on Oct 31, 2011 21:32:19 GMT -5
Distind, I think you need to ask the question.
"If the genders were reversed, would this still be funny?"
Because quite frankly, your attitude about the situation is partially the reason why this topic needs to be made.
"It's not being portrayed seriously, so what's the problem?"
The problem is that it is a problem. The fact that female-on-male abuse is considered comedic is the problem.
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Post by Admiral Lithp on Oct 31, 2011 22:06:06 GMT -5
Honestly, if it's a person trying & pathetically failing at beating another person, that might be funny. I think that does go both ways. But it is considered comedic for a man to be abused badly and it is NOT for that to happen to a woman. That is a problem. How much of a problem depends on how much we accept that the media influences us.
But, you know, I'm not going to lay the blame on all of them. Media influence is just part of cultural influence. And we do know that there are double-standard gender roles in reality. I'm not saying we have to give up slapstick comedy, I'm saying we should be mindful of the difference between reality & fantasy, & pass that knowledge on. Art imitates life & vice versa. But something has to give.
Take, for instance, the MRAs favorite pet topic of rape fantasies. You know there's a profound difference between that & real rape, probably in part because someone took the time to promote awareness of it.
Edit: On the Wedding Crashers example, the guy's "a dick." The woman's a rapist. Having seen both the censored & uncensored version, there is no reference of the man getting women drunk to have sex with them. The most he is guilty of is being a dick. Being raped is "a reversal" in the sense that killing your dog because you didn't clean the shit from my yard would be "a reversal."
To clarify, I loved Wedding Crashers. It was hilarious. ESPECIALLY the subplot in question. I can enjoy the movie, note the double-standard, & acknowledge that this scene would be totally unacceptable in reality all at the same time.
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Post by Dragon Zachski on Oct 31, 2011 22:18:08 GMT -5
To be honest, I picked Wedding Crashers at random. I haven't actually seen the movie.
Either way, I know media is influenced by culture, and culture is influenced by media. It's a weird echo chamber that gives birth to things like Leave it to Beaver, Glee, and Jersey Shore.
Excuse me, I just vomited in my mouth a little.
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Post by Thejebusfire on Oct 31, 2011 22:24:12 GMT -5
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Post by Admiral Lithp on Oct 31, 2011 22:25:50 GMT -5
I've seen the movie. I wouldn't consider it one of my all-time favorites. It's a romantic comedy. That's a pretty stagnant genre spun off of a just-as-stagnant genre. But I do think it was pretty damn funny.
It's pretty much how you described it. He wakes up in the middle of the night to be raped by the woman. And almost raped by her brother. But he dodged the second bullet, so it's okay.
The climax is that the woman reveals that she's not actually a virgin, that's just what she thought guys wanted to hear. This apparently bothers him more than the rape, because he feels like such an asshole for lying to so many women. He then has a complete change of heart & the 4 protagonists run away together on some kind of weird Double Date of Destiny. What's weird--well, besides the man's priorities--is that he has a rule specifically to avoid virgins because "they're clingy."
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Post by Dragon Zachski on Oct 31, 2011 22:28:12 GMT -5
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Post by Vene on Oct 31, 2011 22:41:21 GMT -5
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Post by The Lazy One on Oct 31, 2011 22:46:47 GMT -5
I went out with a woman who actually argued that when she threw things at me or threatened me with a knife she was being "farcical" as she was physically smaller and when I took the knife off her I was being "violent". An acquaintance had his ex-girlfriend pull a switchblade on him when he tried to break up with her. Subsequent attempts resulted in her trying to kill his cat, throwing shit at him, and lurking around in the bushes outside of his house. He ended up hiding out in someone's basement for a few days because psychobitch didn't know where that person lived. Last I heard, she got arrested for assault (on someone else). I don't know what happened to her after that. |
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Post by tolpuddlemartyr on Oct 31, 2011 22:47:55 GMT -5
I note that the FBI's revised version still excludes a woman having sex with a man without his consent unless she penetrates him.
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Post by Wykked Wytch on Oct 31, 2011 22:52:58 GMT -5
For the record, I sincerely want to apologize to anyone I may have offended by posting the monkey pictures. My original intention was to inject some humor into a usually serious discussion. However, in retrospect, I can definitely see how those images have hurt other people's feelings.
I don't think that female-on-male abuse is okay or funny. In real life, I do try to point out the double standards whenever the topic comes up, because frankly we hear so much about violence towards women that we assume that only women are qualified to talk about their feelings on the topic. (Sort of how invoking a Godwin is a taboo in any rational discussion, unless it's brought up by someone who's Jewish in which case you should totally listen to what they have to say because the Jews suffered under the Nazis' regime and stuff. But I digress.) Feminism doesn't talk about that issue a lot, and men's rights activists who are not misogynists in sheep's clothing are either rare or not very vocal.
I remember I brought up To Kill A Mockingbird at the dinner table and it ended up in a fight with my parents over whether Mayella Ewell's "seducing" of Tom Robinson was rape. I argued that it was definitely attempted rape because she was forcing sexual contact on him that he did not want. This is indicated in Tom's testimony, where he says Mayella lured him into the house (under the pretext of having work for him to do) and then "jumped him" and initiated contact (so to speak) when he had his back turned. Tom made it clear he wanted to leave and tried to escape. But by the time Bob Ewell came home, he saw Mayella raping Tom and assumed that it was Tom who raped Mayella, not the other way around. I dare you to re-read to the courtroom chapters and tell me, with a straight face, that what Mayella did according to Tom's testimony does not qualify as attempted rape, or at the very least, sexual harassment.
So once again, I want to apologize to anyone who I may have offended and clarify my own position on the issue in my own words, and not in the words of ironic self-deprecating primates.
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Post by Admiral Lithp on Oct 31, 2011 23:05:34 GMT -5
I, for one, would like to apologize for hurting the monkey's feelings. You weren't annoying. You were just in the wrong place at the wrong time. I'm sorry, monkey, please don't throw poop at me.
Wykked, I don't think I did anything to offend you, but if I did, that was not my intention either.
Thinking back, I'm pretty sure I did look at Mayella as sexual harrassment. Didn't she block the door or something? I'm not sure what that counts as. But I was sort of distracted by the fact that she was trying to get Tom sent to jail &/or killed to save her own ass.
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Post by Vene on Oct 31, 2011 23:10:44 GMT -5
I note that the FBI's revised version still excludes a woman having sex with a man without his consent unless she penetrates him. It still has work to do, but it is more reasonable. Oh, and it includes forced oral sex. |
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Post by Dragon Zachski on Oct 31, 2011 23:12:43 GMT -5
For the record, I sincerely want to apologize to anyone I may have offended by posting the monkey pictures. My original intention was to inject some humor into a usually serious discussion. However, in retrospect, I can definitely see how those images have hurt other people's feelings. Ah. So you weren't actually serious or even intending to call me a rape apologist in the first place? In that case, it's in the past now. Sorry for being harsh. |
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