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Post by booley on Oct 26, 2011 15:20:56 GMT -5
I'm going to assume that AA is Poeing there. Yes, even him. Oh sure. But when I criticise police for disproportionate response... AA is making a sarcastic jab at the forum populace because he thinks we all love to lick police boot... simply because we disagree that police aren't all completely corrupt thugs. And he also happens to think that internal investigations are nothing more than a conspiracy to give the populace false assurance. That being said, I do understand why people jumped all over you for those threads. I disagree with it, but I do understand why. I know it's fun to jump on the anti AA band wagon. And AA provides so much good material to do it with. I do it myself. But in this case he's kind of right. Many here are prone to give the cops the benefit of the doubt or brush this sort of thing as some kind of isolated incident. Even to what seems to me extremes of simply ignoring what really happened. And one doesn't have to use these multiple "isolated incidents" to broad brush every cop as a fascist because that's what many here will will hear regardless. I am surprised that no one here has yet to defend this. I find it hopeful that there is some kind of limit to what the cops can do before we can think maybe this is a systemic problem. Though it's also scary to think we are approaching that limit. |
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Post by Smurfette Principle on Oct 26, 2011 15:37:31 GMT -5
Talked to a friend of mine from California. Apparently gassing protesters is standard procedure in Oakland, and the system there is highly corrupt. The courts usually side with the police and let them get away with a lot. She's not anti-police, nor does she have any personal reason to dislike them - that's just how it is, she says.
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Post by lighthorseman on Oct 26, 2011 15:45:16 GMT -5
Talked to a friend of mine from California. Apparently gassing protesters is standard procedure in Oakland, and the system there is highly corrupt. The courts usually side with the police and let them get away with a lot. She's not anti-police, nor does she have any personal reason to dislike them - that's just how it is, she says. So what exactly are you trying to say there smurfetteprinciple? That this is some nation wide problem of police getting pissed off at people protesting and that the police should just be disbanded and the rest of society should be left to fend for itself? I mean, that's what you want right?[/unemployable moron] |
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Post by Distind on Oct 26, 2011 15:45:43 GMT -5
The over reaction of this is done by the riot squads/police is what worries me the most. How far can you push people who are doing a peaceful protest before you push them too far and peace becomes chaos and violent. Or you know how many times can you poke the dog with a stick before he bites... From my own experience there's more running and hiding involved than biting. I don't know if it's entirely legal, but when compared to sending a few cops into a mob and telling it to dispurse it's the logical approach from their end. Kinda like how opening fire with pepper rounds on a crowd was logical when one douche in the crowed tossed a bottle at them and missed at my school. Everyone ran, some got hosed down with pepper rounds on their door step when they were locked out, and generally speaking nothing happened except the media covering the 'riot' at the school. Which had a remarkable lack of detail on what the riot entailed and what the police response was. |
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Post by lighthorseman on Oct 26, 2011 15:49:40 GMT -5
The over reaction of this is done by the riot squads/police is what worries me the most. How far can you push people who are doing a peaceful protest before you push them too far and peace becomes chaos and violent. Or you know how many times can you poke the dog with a stick before he bites... ...except the media covering the 'riot' at the school. Which had a remarkable lack of detail on what the riot entailed and what the police response was. This is pretty common, in my experience. Frankly, I am surprised that the OWS protesters have recieved as much in depth media coverage as they have. Just about any other protest movement, the media will say that its there, and what their interactions with the police are, but its almost unheard of for the media to attempt to explain what the motivations of the movement are. Check out any media report about an anti globalisation rally, or an environmental one... or the recent London riots. The actions of the protesters are virtually always portrayed as utterly incomprehensible and causeless, as though they just somehow happened when a bunch of crazy people got together and decided to make trouble. |
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Post by gyeonghwa on Oct 26, 2011 15:54:23 GMT -5
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Post by Dragon Zachski on Oct 26, 2011 15:56:59 GMT -5
AA is making a sarcastic jab at the forum populace because he thinks we all love to lick police boot... simply because we disagree that police aren't all completely corrupt thugs. And he also happens to think that internal investigations are nothing more than a conspiracy to give the populace false assurance. That being said, I do understand why people jumped all over you for those threads. I disagree with it, but I do understand why. I know it's fun to jump on the anti AA band wagon. And AA provides so much good material to do it with. I do it myself. But in this case he's kind of right. Many here are prone to give the cops the benefit of the doubt or brush this sort of thing as some kind of isolated incident. Even to what seems to me extremes of simply ignoring what really happened. And one doesn't have to use these multiple "isolated incidents" to broad brush every cop as a fascist because that's what many here will will hear regardless. I am surprised that no one here has yet to defend this. I find it hopeful that there is some kind of limit to what the cops can do before we can think maybe this is a systemic problem. Though it's also scary to think we are approaching that limit. I don't really see anyone defending the police here. Do you? Quite frankly, I thought it went without saying that we are disappointed that this is happening on such a large scale. I don't know how many policemen are doing this because they have to or because they want to, and I don't care. That being said, I'm not going to judge the police who are actually stopping crime based on the actions of the police who are, quite frankly, committing crime. |
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Post by m52nickerson on Oct 26, 2011 16:20:20 GMT -5
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Post by Dragon Zachski on Oct 26, 2011 16:26:44 GMT -5
While that website makes me happy, ALL police? Really? |
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Post by Smurfette Principle on Oct 26, 2011 16:52:10 GMT -5
Talked to a friend of mine from California. Apparently gassing protesters is standard procedure in Oakland, and the system there is highly corrupt. The courts usually side with the police and let them get away with a lot. She's not anti-police, nor does she have any personal reason to dislike them - that's just how it is, she says. So what exactly are you trying to say there smurfetteprinciple? That this is some nation wide problem of police getting pissed off at people protesting and that the police should just be disbanded and the rest of society should be left to fend for itself? I mean, that's what you want right?[/unemployable moron] Hey, I was the first one to defend you when that argument came up. Take it up with ironbite, not me. |
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Post by Mlle Antéchrist on Oct 26, 2011 17:43:40 GMT -5
... Ironbite, I'm going to need to borrow your anger dome for a bit. |
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Post by m52nickerson on Oct 26, 2011 17:49:52 GMT -5
While that website makes me happy, ALL police? Really? that should have been "not all police"! |
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Post by aboveathletics on Oct 26, 2011 17:59:43 GMT -5
I know it's fun to jump on the anti AA band wagon. And AA provides so much good material to do it with. I do it myself. But in this case he's kind of right. Many here are prone to give the cops the benefit of the doubt or brush this sort of thing as some kind of isolated incident. Even to what seems to me extremes of simply ignoring what really happened. And one doesn't have to use these multiple "isolated incidents" to broad brush every cop as a fascist because that's what many here will will hear regardless. I am surprised that no one here has yet to defend this. I find it hopeful that there is some kind of limit to what the cops can do before we can think maybe this is a systemic problem. Though it's also scary to think we are approaching that limit. I don't really see anyone defending the police here. Do you? Quite frankly, I thought it went without saying that we are disappointed that this is happening on such a large scale. I don't know how many policemen are doing this because they have to or because they want to, and I don't care. That being said, I'm not going to judge the police who are actually stopping crime based on the actions of the police who are, quite frankly, committing crime. You're right, no one is defending cops in this thread (except me, sarcastically). I am really not sure what to make of this. I'm wholeheartedly against this obviously, but as far as police brutality/corruption goes this is like really really small potatoes. Even I'M not all that worked up about it. It's unethical and unwarranted, but nowhere near the same level of utter evil as the cops who planted drugs on people to get more convictions (defended on this site), or shooting unarmed individuals and dogs for no reason (also defended on this site). Why is this met with outrage and other things not? It couldn't be the fact that OWS ideology jives with the general Marxist vibe of this site. Nah, FSTDT wouldn't be that blindly partisan. You'd totally be this outraged if this was the Tea Party or a Pro Life group... |
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Post by Mlle Antéchrist on Oct 26, 2011 18:03:53 GMT -5
And in both of those threads, there were more people condemning the cops' actions than defending them.
I agree that there have been instances where people have defended some pretty fucked up shit on this forum, but stop lumping everyone in together.
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Post by ltfred on Oct 26, 2011 18:32:23 GMT -5
You'd totally be this outraged if this was the Tea Party or a Pro Life group... Pro-lifers are often terrorists, wheras OWS are non-violent. So yu can imagine circumstances where it would be acceptable to treat a group with a history of violence somewhat rougher than a bunch of liberals* in tents. Using gas would be, of course, a last resort- or should be. * OWS are mostly liberals, the opposite of Marxists. |
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