|
Post by The_L on Dec 1, 2011 19:40:55 GMT -5
Blessed Yule, everybody!
|
|
|
Post by Ian1732 on Dec 1, 2011 21:55:07 GMT -5
I say just create a conglomerate of holidays in one massive decoration. A menorah on top of a Christmas tree, for example.
|
|
|
Post by Admiral Lithp on Dec 1, 2011 22:27:10 GMT -5
I just want him to admit that he clearly has his own bias. That there is no goddamn reason to be so anal about calling it a "Christmas Tree" versus a "Holiday Tree." But, no, he has to keep bending over backwards to try & make it look like everything he says is non-opinionated, & if you disagree with it you're just being stupid.
|
|
|
Post by N. De Plume on Dec 1, 2011 22:43:41 GMT -5
I say just create a conglomerate of holidays in one massive decoration. A menorah on top of a Christmas tree, for example.
|
|
|
Post by DarkfireTaimatsu on Dec 1, 2011 23:44:31 GMT -5
I say just create a conglomerate of holidays in one massive decoration. A menorah on top of a Christmas tree, for example. I've long tried to talk Mum into a black tree with pumpkin lights and maybe fake spiderwebs instead of tinsel, but she don't wanna listen.
|
|
|
Post by cestlefun17 on Dec 2, 2011 4:36:39 GMT -5
Yes, I have a bias towards calling it a Christmas tree. But I'm not writing a newspaper article about it, I'm posting my opinion on an Internet forum.
|
|
|
Post by Vene on Dec 2, 2011 11:00:18 GMT -5
Yes, I have a bias towards calling it a Christmas tree. But I'm not writing a newspaper article about it, I'm posting my opinion on an Internet forum. The opinion defense is pretty pathetic, they're also posting their opinion on an internet forum.
|
|
|
Post by cestlefun17 on Dec 2, 2011 11:32:06 GMT -5
Right...we're all posting our opinions. I really don't understand what the purpose of Admiral Lithp's post was.
|
|
|
Post by Tenfold_Maquette on Dec 2, 2011 12:01:45 GMT -5
This just is not true. The history of the holiday has a strong non-Christian tradition. There is nothing Christian about a Christmas tree. Christmas trees do not appear in any of Christianity's holy text (except to call them symbols of heathens, see Jeremiah 10). If modern-day Christians conflate the Christian tradition of Christmas with the pagan-related tradition that preceded it, then that is reflective of their ignorance and not the holiday itself. If you point to the pine tree covered in glittering lights, tinsel, and ornaments and ask people what that is, they're going to reply "It's a Christmas tree." It is commonly associated with Christmas, which is a Christian holiday. It doesn't matter that the tree or festival originated elsewhere - the modern, relevant-to-the-modern-era use of that symbol is paired with the Christmas holiday. That's where the whole whine of "But you can't call it a 'holiday tree', it's a Christmas tree!" comes from; to the majority of Americans, the glittery tree IS associated with the Christmas holiday and is NOT secular in any fashion. Yes it has other meanings, and yes it originated outside of the Christian faith. But right here, right now, in the modern era, it is representative of the Christian holiday of "Christmas" for a wide enough swath of the population as to be indistinguishable from a "true" symbol for the Christian holiday.
|
|
|
Post by Vene on Dec 2, 2011 13:15:45 GMT -5
Right...we're all posting our opinions. I really don't understand what the purpose of Admiral Lithp's post was. Here is how it reads: Cestle: I wanna call it a Christmas Tree! Others: I think other terms are good too/better! Cestle: I don't understand what your problem is, I'm just posting an opinion. It looks like you're holding a double standard, it's allowable for you to criticize other's opinions and state your own, but when other people try to do it, you call foul.
|
|
|
Post by Kit Walker on Dec 2, 2011 13:42:39 GMT -5
I think calling call a Christmas Tree a "Holiday Tree" is as stupid as calling a Menorah or a Kinara as a "Holiday Candelabra", or calling fasting during Ramadan a "Holiday Diet Plan". It is associated with a specific holiday. There's being politically correct and inclusive and then there's being an idiot.
|
|
|
Post by m52nickerson on Dec 2, 2011 13:53:25 GMT -5
to the majority of Americans, the glittery tree IS associated with the Christmas holiday and is NOT secular in any fashion. Tell that to the millions of Americans the celebrate Christmas, but are not christian. Or as mentioned before all the Christmas specials that talk about the Christmas tree and Santa Claus but never once mention the birth of Christ. Even the courts have rules that Christmas has become largely a secular holiday.
|
|
|
Post by Tenfold_Maquette on Dec 2, 2011 14:29:22 GMT -5
to the majority of Americans, the glittery tree IS associated with the Christmas holiday and is NOT secular in any fashion. Tell that to the millions of Americans the celebrate Christmas, but are not christian. Or as mentioned before all the Christmas specials that talk about the Christmas tree and Santa Claus but never once mention the birth of Christ. Even the courts have rules that Christmas has become largely a secular holiday. Approximately 70% of the country is Christian, so it's not surprising that even people who do not profess belief in that religion are still exposed to and, to whatever degree, participate in the rituals associated thereof. It doesn't make them Christian by default, but it does mean they are participating in a holiday that 70% of the country (minimum) identifies as having ties to the Christian faith.
|
|
|
Post by nizkateth on Dec 2, 2011 14:40:50 GMT -5
Strange that a Christ Mass tree has to be more clearly defined as Christian.
And even if it draws from old pagan beliefs... then the pagan religions need to get off public property with their sparkly trees.
|
|
|
Post by mechtaur on Dec 2, 2011 15:27:30 GMT -5
Strange that a Christ Mass tree has to be more clearly defined as Christian. And even if it draws from old pagan beliefs... then the pagan religions need to get off public property with their sparkly trees. I'm sorry, but what are you talking about? Why should non-Abrahamic religions have to "get off public property", but not the Abrahamic ones? And this isn't a case of "if it draws from old pagan beliefs", this is a case of being able to clearly find where it started in history or even just reading the freaking Bible.
|
|